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Warm a/c while driving in the city [Solved]

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Africa_FS_07
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Re: warm a/c while driving in the city

Post by Africa_FS_07 » Tue Jun 21, 2011 11:31 am

jaydee427 wrote:I just took a chill pill, but until it kicks in................Here's a gas / money saving tip. Drive downhill only with no other passengers, engine off, and shifter in "neutral". Guaranteed to get over 500 MPG's. Now, for that great idea, any donations?......lol :lol:

:lol:
i wonder who "Voodoo Bob of the Dead Poets Society" is hounding now.....:mrgreen:

kh22
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Re: warm a/c while driving in the city

Post by kh22 » Wed Jun 22, 2011 8:23 pm

I have a 2005 SEL Freestyle with the separate rear AC climate control option. Isn't the requirement for this car 2lbs 6oz of refrigerant?

After replacing the valve myself, I took it to a shop to charge it with refrigerant and their machine (one of those Snap-On AC charging stations) failed charging at 1lb 15 oz. The guy said my car only took 1 lb 13 oz after all and charged to that level instead.

The air is cool even at idle now, but the volume of air pushing out of the vents feels low.

tucker
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Re: warm a/c while driving in the city

Post by tucker » Sun Jun 26, 2011 6:47 pm

There is an info sticker under the hood that specifies the freon capacity with and without rear A/C. It should be located in plain view above the radiator. If you think the system is a little light on freon, just ask your mechanic.

Wheelman
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Re: warm a/c while driving in the city

Post by Wheelman » Sun Jun 26, 2011 8:22 pm

The volume of air has nothing to do with the refrigerant. What it has to do with is your fan speed and/or unobstructed air ways.

kh22
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Re: warm a/c while driving in the city

Post by kh22 » Mon Jun 27, 2011 9:42 am

tucker: thanks, yes I have that sticker. I pointed that out to the mechanic and told him I had rear AC. When his machine failed to charge it to 2lb 6oz, I assume he thought I didn't know what I was talking about. I just wanted to ask here to make sure there wasn't some Limited trim A/C option I wasn't aware of that the sticker might be referring to.

Wheelman: yes, this is my concern, but I'd like to fix the problem I know about -- low refrigerant -- and then see what else isn't working. I don't recall cabin airflow being a problem before the control valve replacement -- it would blow fine, just warm at idle. Now that the valve is replaced I have cool air, but an apparent blower issue? Doesn't make sense to me that I would get another random but slightly related failure. I have not been running the AC while driving since this ordeal started.

kh22
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Re: warm a/c while driving in the city

Post by kh22 » Fri Jul 01, 2011 5:10 am

Update: everything is fixed now.

I was going to try and top off the refrigerant myself, but was concerned about getting the proper weight in the system. So I took it by yet another shop and they pulled the charge, then refilled to the proper 2lbs 6oz. They tested it and couldn't detect any issue with the air volume at the vents.

When I picked it up, the air volume seemed fine. So I'm not sure if it was in my head, or if the cooling was sub-optimal with the low charge and it just made the air volume feel low.

Whatever the case, it's working well now. Very cold at idle and RPMs. All it was for me was the valve replacement and a proper r134 charge. It ended up costing me a couple hundred bucks due to the initial diagnosis and then having to get these shops to charge the system, but it's better than the $2100 I was quoted with at the beginning.

Thanks to everyone here for the advice and help.

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TRexer
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Re: warm a/c while driving in the city

Post by TRexer » Fri Jul 01, 2011 6:33 am

sdischar wrote:How do you evacuate the ac refrigerant?
To evacuate the system, you will need a refrigerant recovery machine. These cost about $3000 and usually this is best left up to a shop, and to just evacuate, they won't charge you very much. I think they should do this for free if they're not charging it too since this is the equivalent of them charging you to take your used motor oil. Technically you could just hook up a fill hose to it and not connect anything to the other side, but this is against EPA regs and you will be fined big time if caught. I don't recommend this, it's very harzardous to breathe in R134 or R12. Also if you're going to do this and open the system, you will have to do a deep vacuum with a venturi or equivalent type pump to get all the air out. I hope this helps with your project.
2008 Ford Taurus X SEL FWD
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smajs1989
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Re: warm a/c while driving in the city

Post by smajs1989 » Sun Jul 03, 2011 10:55 am

Spidy18 and all others with their inputs, Thanks mucho biggie for the write-up! My A/C is again cooling as should (45-50F) in the city now. I thought I'd list how much it cost me to do this job. I could have saved about $120 on the tools by borrowing them from one of the auto parts stores, but I thought I'd buy them and add it to my collection for the next time I need to recharge the A/C on one of my other vehicles. Also, I'm in SoCal and I had to put up with a few additional costs due some California EPA laws.
An additional note I'd like to mention; it was tough getting my fat hands down to remove the plate to access the valve. It was harder to put it back on (it was hard to hold the bolts until the threads connected). Fortunately, I have a long 45deg angle socket extension tool I was able to use to remove and return the bolts.

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Africa_FS_07
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Re: warm a/c while driving in the city

Post by Africa_FS_07 » Mon Jul 04, 2011 11:32 am

smajs1989,

both YOUTUBE links you wrote are not opening.....are there errors in the addresses?
i wonder who "Voodoo Bob of the Dead Poets Society" is hounding now.....:mrgreen:

smajs1989
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Re: warm a/c while driving in the city

Post by smajs1989 » Mon Jul 04, 2011 12:20 pm

Africa_FS_07,

Well, it works for me; I just tried it by clicking on the links in my post, but give the following a try instead:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F5w3lR8 ... e=youtu.be
and
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNsyiFR ... e=youtu.be

Thanks for reading my post,

Sam

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Africa_FS_07
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Re: warm a/c while driving in the city

Post by Africa_FS_07 » Mon Jul 04, 2011 3:39 pm

great.

the ones you've just posted open very well.

thanks for posting the videos.....
i wonder who "Voodoo Bob of the Dead Poets Society" is hounding now.....:mrgreen:

mikeb445
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Re: warm a/c while driving in the city

Post by mikeb445 » Fri Jul 08, 2011 1:29 pm

Just wanted to say THANK YOU to everyone who recommended replacing the scroll valve before the whole a/c compressor! 2006 FS with 94k just started blowing cool (not cold) air. Quoted anywhere from $1400 to $2000 to replace the a/c compressor with drier and other parts from 4 different shops in Kansas City... Instead asked a shop to try this $40 valve first, which was less than $300 with labor and freon evac and recharge. They didn't make any garauntees, but were willing to try this first. AND, it worked! Ice cold like new again!

I have read one other post which my mechanic also pointed out... these valves typically get stuck open due to debris running thru them, which is typically a piece of the compressor coming off. He did warn that this might only be a "bandaid" fix and the compressor might still be dying a slow death. How long have you all had a new valve in place???

So at least for the short term, I just made $1200+ by spending a few lunch hours on the 'net doing my own research. This is my new favorite website! Plan on tying to contribute whenever I can from now on.

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Africa_FS_07
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Re: warm a/c while driving in the city

Post by Africa_FS_07 » Sat Jul 09, 2011 12:53 am

mikeb445 wrote:I have read one other post which my mechanic also pointed out... these valves typically get stuck open due to debris running thru them, which is typically a piece of the compressor coming off. He did warn that this might only be a "bandaid" fix and the compressor might still be dying a slow death.
i can't remember seeing anywhere in the forum where it was said that the source of the valve's fault is the compressor's parts breaking up slowly.....i can't also remember reading the valve change being a temporary fix in the case of non-faulty compressors ......

could you please post the link to these?



mikeb445 wrote:So at least for the short term, I just made $1200+ by spending a few lunch hours on the 'net doing my own research. This is my new favorite website! Plan on tying to contribute whenever I can from now on.
wow, that's quite a pile of savings...it pays a lot to research stuff independently, not just listening to mechanics alone!!!!

same favorite website too.....i'm always poring through it when i'm less busy.....

congratulations on your fix!
i wonder who "Voodoo Bob of the Dead Poets Society" is hounding now.....:mrgreen:

sojerz
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Re: warm a/c while driving in the city

Post by sojerz » Sun Jul 10, 2011 6:03 pm

Like Mike above i bought the scroll control valve and just had a mechanic evacuate the refrigerant, install the valve, and recharge; the AC is working perfectly. I had printer out spidy's instructions and he found it very helpful. They're very good auto mechanics and werre not aware that this fix is avaialble for ford freestyles. It cost $100 in labor, $50 for refirgerant and $30 for the valve. I had been quoted $500-$1500 by ford to repalce the expansion valve or if necessary the compresor and other filters etc. Ford will not work on a compressor, they just replace the whole thing and i would have been out $1300 more!
My mechanic gave me the old vavle and i will post pics when I get a chance. The vavle has an o-ring near the top of the valve that is seated in a circumferential groove. The o-ring on the old vavle was warn flat, but the 0-ring on the new valve was rounded and I think protruded slightly above the circumference like a ring on a piston. My theory is that once the o-ring wears flat, it allows the cylindiriical valve to have to much "wiggle" room and the valve seizes. You might be able to just repalce that o-ring and stick the valve body itself back in (but for $30 why chance it). I'm thinking it is not failiing compressor pieces or dirt that causess the vavle to seize, but that o-ring wearing flat after about 70,000 miles or so that casues the problem with the valve's action. I'm going to buy a few spares in case it happen s again in another 70,000 miles and iwll post pics of the old an new valves.
Bill 2005 Ford Freestyle Limited

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jas88
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Re: warm a/c while driving in the city

Post by jas88 » Fri Jul 15, 2011 10:24 am

How long have you all had a new valve in place???
I did not replace my valve, I merely depressed it all the way into the bore using a big nut. But that fix has been in place for over a year and I just got back last night from Palo Duro Canyon (Texas) where the ambient temps each day were reading 105-107 and the a/c system handled it just fine.
2006 SE Silver w/Slate cloth

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