Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Matt28
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Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Post by Matt28 » Wed Jun 14, 2017 4:30 pm

Hey everyone I am seeking help on my 2006 Ford Freestyle SE. I have been experiencing a deep vibration in the vehicle in every gear from 1300-1700 RPM. I have had a lot of work done to it in the last couple months. I have replaced the ERG valve, the entire suspension in the front end including control arms and bushings, tie rods, stabilizer links, the exhaust pipe with the flex pipe, all 6 injectors, fuel rail, fuel sensor,all coil packs, spark plugs with Iridium's, fuel filter, Mass air flow sensor, cleaned the throttle body and entire intake and intake gaskets replaced. Before all the work began the vehicle was running fine. Before I wanted to update the vehicle I was only experiencing a loud exhaust as the flexpipe was leaking. I had no vibration or clunking or anything. I first ran seafoam through the brake booster as I have done so in past to clean out the injector. After doing that the vehicle started running a little rough. I took it to the shop to have the front end worked on along with the exhaust replaced. When I got the vehicle back there was a deep vibration from what sounded like under the vehicle around 1300-1700 RPMs. I figured run another 1/3 of the can of seafoam through again as I may have dislodged something and is making it run rough and deep. I did so and a the check engine light came on a week later while still experiencing the deep vibration. I read the codes and the vehicle was running lean on both banks and a coil pack F code I believe. I preformed a smoke test and found a very small leak on a vacuum hose to throttle body and smoke coming from the oil port. I decided solve all the problems that could be causing the lean codes so I replaced the ERG valve that could have been making it run rough and poor smoke into the oil compartment, the spark plugs as they were white and perhaps fouled, the coil packs, cleaned the entire intake with many cans of carb cleaner, replaced the fuel rail and all the injectors and fuel sensor. After the work was done I let the engine idle for 15 minutes, So it could learn the throttle positioning and took it for a easy test drive for 20 minutes. The check engine light came on 15 minutes into the drive with several codes like low voltage on the EGR and moitors not up. The next day I start it up and the engine light was out and drove it for a solid 140 miles with no lights on at all and the engine idles like a kitten and runs absolutely perfect! So I took it to the shop today to address the deep vibration as it was still happening as before. I figured it had to be because of the exhaust. I took it in and they found the front end tight with no noise at all and found nothing wrong with the exhaust accept the rear catalytic converter was making a slight noise like sand was in it. They did not believe it was the issue. So I called my father a shop manager of 22 years and he said it sounds like the exhaust from the engine is sending a vibration at a certain frequency to cause the vibration into the new exhaust. He said it is a tough and uncertain fix. So I pull the car up on the ramps in the driveway and have the wife get in the vehicle and rev the engine to those RPMs as you can hear it ever so slightly in park/Neutral. I put a pair of vice grips on the exhaust closest to the front and you get a deep vibration through the exhaust almost like the exhaust gasses are being funneled or restricted. The exhaust is not plugged by any means and is super quiet as its suppose to be. Everyone I speak with is at a loss as what could be causing the deep vibration at ONLY those RPMs ONLY when the gas is presses even the slightest. I even placed a 2x4 block of wood pinning the exhaust and it still happens. I have no check engine codes and the monitors are up. I thought it might be the motor mounts but they appear okay on the bottom and the top mount was replaced 2 years ago and is still perfect. The engine does not rock much during revving and has no noise. Anyone have any ideas what this could be because I do not know what else to throw at it to solve the problem?


Matt28
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Re: Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Post by Matt28 » Wed Jun 14, 2017 4:34 pm

I should also note that placing the vehicle in reverse and drive a couple times after revving shows no signs of noises that it could be a bad torque converter. Plus it shifts through all the gears perfectly and stays in gear solid.

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Lord_Snax
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Re: Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Post by Lord_Snax » Wed Jun 14, 2017 8:59 pm

I am kind of stumped on this one, but the transmission does have a bearing or bushing on the through shaft on the transmission behind the torque converter. If that goes bad, it can cause a trans fluid leak, so it may be a contributing factor to your vibration issue.

On the other hand you mentioned that there is no noise or vibration in reverse, if I understand you correctly. I would check the transmission for a bad bearing or clutch pack. Check the torque converter as well.

It might also be a bad motor mount or transmission mount that is allowing more vibration to enter the cabin of the car than should be. So I would have the motor mounts inspected. That would explain why the car makes no noise in reverse, as the transmission is twisting the other way in reverse re-leaving the vibration noise from the car.

Matt28
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Re: Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Post by Matt28 » Thu Jun 15, 2017 8:02 am

Lord_Snax,

I have checked the shaft and it appears to be sweating as is the oil pan seal, although I do no believe that they are the source of the vibration. I was told that the only real way to check the torque converter since its not displaying any other symptoms is to place it in drive and in reverse and revving the engine slightly between shifting and listening for clicking/grinding. whining...etc. In doing that we only heard the normal shifting into gear and then quiet.

The engine mounts are difficult to inspect and see under the engine but again there is no movement at all in the engine in shifting from park and into drive and reverse. I will likely replace the motor mounts in the fall just to see but it is a huge pain to get to apparently.

As for the bad transmission bearing and clutch I haven't had it check as the vehicle drives and shifts so smoothly but will have a mechanic check that out.

I had another mechanic listen and drive it and he says he is also stumped as to what it could be but it almost sounds as if the engine is misfiring at only those RPMs sending the misfire vibration though the exhaust. Any more thoughts is more than welcome and needed.

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Lord_Snax
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Re: Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Post by Lord_Snax » Thu Jun 15, 2017 8:14 pm

You mentioned that you put the Seafoam in via the brake booster. I personally never heard of people putting Seafoam in via that method. If I remember correctly, Seafoam can cause the engine to run rough after first using it. There may be a little still left in the brake booster that is causing the engine to run rough.

Also, make sure that all the spark plugs are set to .045" Any gap larger or smaller could affect the engine.

One last guess about the vibration. Can you look under the car yourself? If the exhaust is still a suspect, look for any signs of metal rubbing against the car's under body. Make sure to check the exhaust heat shield on the back side of the engine (the side facing the firewall) to make sure it is mounted correctly.

Also, check all the rubber loops or grommets that hold the exhaust under the car and make sure no mechanics have used something else to mount the pipes.

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Splicer
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Re: Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Post by Splicer » Thu Jun 15, 2017 8:52 pm

It's the trans, plain and simple. Mine has had it for years now. Up to about 35mph. The steel belt is slipping on the drum at that low speed.
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Matt28
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Re: Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Post by Matt28 » Fri Jun 16, 2017 5:57 am

Lord_Snax

The engine running rough has been solved with all the engine work done. And all the spark plugs were properly gaped. Upon yesterdays visit to another mechanic they believe that the vibration is in the new pipes flex. So I started a return and another exhaust is on its way.

Splicer,

I had the transmission ruled out several time by 3 different shops and by Ford. Everyone assures me that the vibration is very strange and has to be coming from the engine or the exhaust as it is clearly felt and heard from the exhaust. I had the motor mounts also inspected and the latest mechanic agreed with me that the bushings are solid and the motor has almost no movement. The latest mechanic believes that it is a defective flex pipe in the new exhaust causing the vibration. I ordered a replacement and we will see if that resolves the issue. The mechanic said that for some reason a lot of fords and GMs are common for an exhaust vibration in the flex pipes. He said it has to do with the pressure from the engine and location of the flex to cause the vibrations. To be honest this is the first mechanic that sounds like he has any idea what this loud deep vibration is and sorta makes it sound like it could be the issue.

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Lord_Snax
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Re: Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Post by Lord_Snax » Fri Jun 16, 2017 6:50 am

Matt28 wrote:Lord_Snax

The engine running rough has been solved with all the engine work done. And all the spark plugs were properly gaped. Upon yesterdays visit to another mechanic they believe that the vibration is in the new pipes flex. So I started a return and another exhaust is on its way.
Alrighty, I hope that fixes your issue.

Good luck,
Lord Snax

pmassey31545
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Re: Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Post by pmassey31545 » Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:13 am

Well? Any news?

Also, you've mentioned the motor mounts on the bottom side, but what about the one up top? Could that cause excessive vibration? They wear out pretty darn easy.
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Matt28
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Re: Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Post by Matt28 » Fri Jun 23, 2017 5:02 am

Pmassey31545,

I just got the exhaust pipe in today and will put it on tonight. I replaced the top motor mount 2 years ago and it is still in perfect condition. I had the other 2 motor mounts looked at and the mechanic agrees that they are fine still and the engine is not the reason for the deep vibration. We will find out tonight if the exhausts flex pipe was the reason for the vibration.

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Re: Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Post by Matt28 » Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:37 am

***UPDATE***

It has been a long rode to replacing the exhaust pipe where the front and rear manifolds meet but, discovered that the reason why I got a deep vibration was because of that pipe. After installing the new replacement pipe I still experienced the noise but it was quieter. I decided to take the pipe off and try a complete new approach to the pipe. I purchased a can of high temp silicone for gasket making, 2 cans of high temp silicone spray and fiberglass exhaust wrap. After working in the silicone gasket maker into the flex pipe, I sprayed the silicone spray on the entire exhaust and wrapped the entire thing in fiberglass exhaust wrapping. I then sprayed the exhaust wrap with a couple protective coats of the silicone spray again. I let it dry over night and them put the exhaust back on and took it for a test drive. I had a significant decrease in the vibration to an almost unnoticeable sound. The exhaust is a little smoky due to the silicone spray baking on as it says it will do but I am very happy I discovered that the flex pipe was transferring the sound throughout the vehicle. It only took 8 mechanics, 3 shops, 3 new exhaust pipes, and me breaking down to do the exhaust the last time. Thanks everyone for there help!!

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Lord_Snax
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Re: Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Post by Lord_Snax » Tue Jul 18, 2017 6:35 pm

Glad to hear everything is finally back into working order!

Matt28
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Re: Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Post by Matt28 » Wed Jul 19, 2017 6:40 pm

The deep vibration is back and I am back to square one. The vibration is most definitely quieter when driving but as soon as you stop and you start to reach the 1200-1500 rpm range its still there. Its even worse when you step on the brakes and rev the engine to those RPM's. Anyone have anymore Ideas?

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Lord_Snax
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Re: Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Post by Lord_Snax » Fri Jul 21, 2017 4:52 pm

Just a thought, could you possibly take a video or audio recording while your car is vibrating to see if we can hear anything. It may help.

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Re: Deep vibration at 1300-1700 RPM

Post by LuckyMike » Mon Jul 24, 2017 11:37 am

I have had this issue for a couple of years. Sometimes it's really noisy and other times not so much. I've replaced engine mounts, Control arms, right front CV axle. The only other thing I can think of it the drivers side CV axle. I haven't replaced it yet but am planning on doing it this fall to see if it fixes the issue. If you haven't changed your control arms you probable need to. They make a huge difference.

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