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Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

eddy622611
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Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

Post by eddy622611 » Sun Feb 28, 2016 7:28 pm

We have an 05 Freestyle with 171k. AWD malfunction light comes on after driving a few miles and will stay on till you shut off the engine. When you restart the engine the AWD works fine for a few miles then the light come on again. We've already changed the Haldex fluid and high pressure filter. What should try next the sensor the pump or both? Thanks,eddy622611

Mike51Merc
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Re: Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

Post by Mike51Merc » Mon Feb 29, 2016 5:35 am

Yes.

eddy622611
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Re: Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

Post by eddy622611 » Tue Mar 01, 2016 5:30 am

Thanks, Mike when you say yes. I guess you mean both.

Mike51Merc
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Re: Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

Post by Mike51Merc » Tue Mar 01, 2016 5:43 am

eddy,

Not to be rude, but like most internet forums, you are encouraged to do a search before asking questions that have already been covered. Search terms Haldex, P1889

eddy622611
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Re: Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

Post by eddy622611 » Tue Mar 01, 2016 5:54 pm

Mike, I have read so many threads that I am more confused than ever. Most of the posts seamed to be at least 4 or 5 years old. I hoping that someone might have some current information the I must have overlooked. Thanks for all your help.

Mike51Merc
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Re: Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

Post by Mike51Merc » Wed Mar 02, 2016 6:21 am

eddy,
Here's something I wrote in another thread here:

I recently fixed mine for roughly $441 US in parts ($118 sensor, $243 pump, $50 filter, $30 fluid), plus about 5 hours of my own labor. The DEM (electronic module) rarely breaks and if it does you can have it rebuilt for about $500 US.
Look at the thread here (or search outside here) for Ford Error code P1889. In addition, Ford has a TSB (Technical Service Bulletin) on the issue.
Generally, the advice is to replace the pressure/temperature sensor and if that doesn't fix it, then change the pump. Changing the pump requires removing the driveshaft, which takes a bit of time.

Another good tip is to buy Volvo parts, because they are exactly the same and cost about 60% of the price of Ford parts. Volvo Parts #30651694 Sensor, Pump #30783079 http://amzn.to/2juqngZ , Filter #30787687

The job is a pain, but for $3000CDN, I'd do it all day long every day of the week. Perhaps you can get an independent shop to do it for you after you buy your own parts. It ain't brain surgery.

As far as driving in 2WD, you're from Canada. When it snows you want your AWD to work.

eddy622611
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Re: Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

Post by eddy622611 » Fri Mar 04, 2016 5:18 am

Mike, My wife loves this car. An other than normal wear the car has never had any problems. So we do'nt mind spending the money to keep it alive.The problem is I am not a mechanic and we live in a small town. The mechanics around here as good as they may be have little experience with a CVT. My guy did the fluid and filter change with information that I sourced on this web site. I drove 50 miles to the Volvo dealer to pick up the parts. He told me the Volvo filter (30787687) was wrong. So he called Ford parts and they sold him a CVT high pressure kit (KT5F93-7K172-JK) which seemed to be correct. The part numbers that I have for the sensor and pump are the following. Oil pump (30783079) , Sensor (30651694) These are Volvo parts. I am not too concerned whether We use Volvo or Ford I just don't want to Order in the wrong parts. Any help clearing this up would be great. Thanks again, eddy622611

Mike51Merc
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Re: Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

Post by Mike51Merc » Fri Mar 04, 2016 6:31 am

Eddy, are you talking about the transmission or the rear differential? There seems to be some confusion here. When you say "high pressure filter" that is a component of the transmission, not the rear end so your mechanic is changing the wrong filter, no wonder it didn't fit. When you say "Haldex" that is the rear differential and not the transmission. Haldex is the manufacturer of the fluid coupler for the AWD system. That coupler is located in the rear differential, which was manufactured by Volvo, all of which is installed in a car with a Ford label on it. I can't understand why anyone would get confused. :roll:

Your traction control light is related to a problem in the differential, not the transmission.

If you jack up your Freestyle and look at the rear differential housing, you will see "Volvo" cast into the aluminum. The Ford used Volvo XC90 parts at the time that Ford owned Volvo, so the parts I'm referencing are the exactly the same with different ID numbers and prices.

Mike51Merc
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Re: Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

Post by Mike51Merc » Fri Mar 04, 2016 7:23 am

Eddy,
Changing the pump itself requires two allen-head screws and an electrical connector, the problem is getting access to it. The driveshaft and driveshaft flange have to be removed, and the exhaust pipe needs to be lowered, but any competent mechanic can do it pretty easily. Here's another quote of mine from another thread post:

Yesterday swapped out the pump and thankfully that seems to have cured the problem. Thanks to this forum for teaching me about this repair and the tip to buy Volvo parts at about half the price of Ford's. Basically kept me from the clutches of the stealership and did a $2000 repair for less than $400 cost for pump, sensor, filter, and fluid. :P

Extra Special thanks to the Ford/Volvo/Haldex engineers for putting the pump behind the driveshaft flange and turning a 15 minute job into 5 hours. :twisted:

Here's a some tips for anybody doing this job:

1. If you're working with the car on ramps or a platform lift, the driver's side FRONT tire needs to be raised off the ground (with the shifter in neutral and parking brake off) in order to spin the rear driveshaft. To remove the driveshaft bolts and the 22 mm yoke/flange nut, you'll need to spin the driveshaft and then hold it still to remove the bolts. I found a neat trick was to jack up the front tire to spin driveshaft, then lower it again to hold it still while loosening the bolts.
2. If the driveshaft flange bolts won't turn easily, hit the flange with a propane torch just in the area of that particular bolt;. The bolts are set with blue threadlocker which will free up with heat. Don't get too hot because the joint has rubber components.
3. Drop the carrier bearing crossmember to give the driveshaft some slack.
4. Drop the exhaust support crossmember to give the driveshaft space to drop down.
5. Remove the two middle exhaust rubber donut hangers to let exhaust pipe sag down a bit.

eddy622611
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Re: Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

Post by eddy622611 » Fri Mar 04, 2016 6:39 pm

Now I understand. In my hast I mistook the Haldex being in the CVT not in a separate differential. I am afraid I supplied my mechanic Haldex fluid (30787687) and a filter (30787687) but instructions on how to service a CVT. if this is true do you know if the Volvo Haldex fluid will harm the CVT. Thanks, eddy622611

jpz
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Re: Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

Post by jpz » Fri Mar 04, 2016 8:53 pm

eddy622611 wrote:Now I understand. In my hast I mistook the Haldex being in the CVT not in a separate differential. I am afraid I supplied my mechanic Haldex fluid (30787687) and a filter (30787687) but instructions on how to service a CVT. if this is true do you know if the Volvo Haldex fluid will harm the CVT. Thanks, eddy622611
Wow, that got ugly quick. I'm no expert but there is plenty of information that states to use nothing but approved CVT fluid. The Haldex fluid is not that. I guess at this point the best you can do would be to change the CVT fluid with the right fluid and hope for the best. Being that the the Haldex fluid is already in there it's going to take a lot of work to get it all out, because when you drain the CVT fluid, you are not draining all of the fluid. This could be a costly mistake I'm afraid.
Last edited by jpz on Wed Mar 09, 2016 7:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Mike51Merc
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Re: Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

Post by Mike51Merc » Sat Mar 05, 2016 6:53 am

The CVT takes about 9-10 quarts of fluid, but the Haldex uses less than a quart. Did you really buy that much Haldex oil? JPZ is right, there are dire warnings about contamination of CVT fluid (usually with regular trans fluid). If the Haldex stuff was put in the CVT, you may have a catastrophe waiting to happen, even if you drain it and refill. Then again, it's also possible that it won't harm anything. Good luck.

Your mechanic should be taken out back and thoroughly beaten as a disgrace to his profession. These Haldex units are used not only by Ford and Volvo, but also VW, Audi, Mazda, GM, Saab, Landrover and others so this is not an experiment in a rare unknown feature. I know this and I'm just a hobbyist and never been a pro mechanic.

Oh, just a shout-out to JPZ, I'm located in the Poconos, Monroe County, PA.

eddy622611
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Re: Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

Post by eddy622611 » Sat Mar 05, 2016 4:31 pm

Well I have no one to blame ,but myself. And yes I did buy over $200 worth of Haldex fluid. My new plan is to have the CVT serviced again, with the proper CVT fluid this time. Put some miles on the car to see if the CVT seems ok. Then have the Haldex fixed. The CVT has not shown any ill effects from the wrong fluid as of yet. ( approx. 500 miles ) But we won't drive it anymore till we can drain the fluid out.
Fortunately he was only able to drain out between 4 and 5 qts. So it is less than 50% Haldex fluid in there. Is there a way to drain the CVT completely ?
On a brighter note I'm from Pennsylvania also. I live in Youngsville, Warren Co. But I was raised in Montgomery Co. I really do appreciate both of you taking the time to help me out. eddy622611

Mike51Merc
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Re: Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

Post by Mike51Merc » Sun Mar 06, 2016 6:39 am

Eddy,
Perhaps you should look into the chemistry of the CVT fluid and figure out why it's so special and so incompatible with regular trans fluid. I read that the Haldex fluid is mineral oil. Maybe they are compatible with each other, and after 500 miles I'm surprised that the CVT didn't throw fits (and trouble codes) already. Maybe you've found the Fountain of Youth for your CVT! When these guys talk about trans fluid contamination, they say even the smallest traces of trans fluid will rapidly screw up your CVT. I don't know why.

As far as draining, the only way I know is to pull the trans because the torque converter can't drain any other way.

eddy622611
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Re: Same old story 05 Freestyle problem

Post by eddy622611 » Sun Mar 06, 2016 9:48 am

Fountain of youth, wouldn't that be great. I have a few quarts left, maybe I should drink some. I seem to be slipping. Since a small amount of contamination can be damaging. Do you think that I should drain the CVT a few times to lessen the amount of contamination, just drive it and see what happens or start looking for a new car. Thanks,eddy622611

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